Liddell Ortiz Odds
Director: Micah Brown
Length: 76 minutes without commercials (90 minutes with commercials)
Installment: #104 by ESPN’s count (#105 by Ben’s count, counting the O.J. doc as one installment, although ESPN initially counted it as five different 30 for 30s, but now seems to list it separately, not as part of the series. Additionally, one finished project, Down In The Valley,has been suspended from airing.)
Most Similar To:Catholics vs Convicts, Celtics/Lakers
Grade/Ranking: low to mid 30s
Review: First off, I am not your usual AA 30 for 30 reviewer. But since Ben Koo doesn’t have much interest in the UFC or knowledge about it, I’m stepping it (since, well, I do). Now, onto the review.
Liddell is targeting a few options at the moment. Among them, the former title holder is interested in a trilogy rematch against Ortiz, after having finished the fighter in their two previous match ups. Betting site Bovada has since provided betting odds for the potential match up. Liddell is reportedly set as a +160 underdog, while Ortiz is a. Golden Boy Promotions will break into the MMA game with a trilogy fight between Tito Ortiz and Chuck Liddell. Both fighters are long past their prime, but one is particularly worse for wear. How do the two aging champs match up?
When I first heard about this 30 for 30, I was skeptical about whether or not there would be enough content to create a compelling film. Then I started watching the screener, and about two-thirds of the way in, the story naturally started to shift away from the “Chuck vs Tito” storyline, which bulked up the film a little more and actually made it more compelling.
The first 20 minutes of Chuck & Tito is focused more on creating background on the UFC, Chuck Liddell, and Tito Ortiz for viewers who aren’t avid fans or newer fans, who might not be familiar with the Liddell/Ortiz golden era of 15 years ago. Director Micah Brown does a good job at exploring the careers of Liddell and Ortiz traveling along parallel paths, and how they derailed and eventually intersected in explosive fashion.
Once the focus of the film turns towards the inevitable collision between Liddell and Ortiz, it takes on an anti-Ortiz bias (justifiable or not) that some might not appreciate. As the timeline shifts to between the months prior to the first fight between Liddell and Ortiz and the second fight between the two, UFC president Dana White really starts driving home the “Tito is dumb” talking point (which doesn’t seem too off base), and more of the focus is placed outside of the cage.
As the film rolls along, you can see the UFC beginning to turn away from Ortiz as the face of the promotion and turn toward Liddell. Much of this is because of how difficult Ortiz was to work with, but Liddell’s run of knockout victories that started with the first Ortiz fight naturally draws in eyeballs. I don’t think anyone can blame the UFC for changing their strategy, as we’ve seen numerous times in recent years, but it’s still interesting to see it come into focus in a shorter film instead of in real time over the course of months, or even years.
One of the biggest rivalries in combat sports gets the 30 for 30 treatment ?
'Chuck & Tito' airs Tuesday, October 15 on ESPN. pic.twitter.com/zUQPwpQN6i
— 30 for 30 (@30for30) October 8, 2019
The personal demons of both Ortiz and Liddell are touched upon, though not in extreme detail. Both men had difficult upbringings that are briefly mentioned, and late/post-career struggles. Liddell (and his wife, Heidi) are open about his battles with alcohol, while Ortiz discusses alleged drug abuse by ex-partner Jenna Jameson and domestic violence allegations against him by Jameson. I don’t know how much more mileage Brown could have gotten out of this part of the film, but it wasn’t glossed over, which I’m appreciative of.
The film also doesn’t romanticize the careers of Liddell and Ortiz. Their final fight, an embarrassing charade put on by Golden Boy last November, gets some airtime, and I was cringing while watching it again. White criticizes both men for fighting again, and MMA notables Tank Abbott, Royce Gracie, and John McCarthy all talk about what happens in those late career stages when fighters should hang it up, but just can’t quit. It’s not a perfect end, but at least it’s not the endlessly positive “they love fighting and just can’t quit!!” narrative that gets spun out every so often in combat sports.
Thankfully (which you’d expect, given the participation of White and Lorenzo Fertitta, among others), the UFC played ball with Brown, and there is a ton of archival UFC footage in this film. In reality, it would have been an absolute bust if fight clips weren’t included, but they are.
The two fights (the third Golden Boy fight never took place in my mind) aren’t discussed in extreme detail, which I had expected, but they really don’t need to be. The footage speaks for itself in both cases, and thankfully, the UFC has it uploaded on YouTube as a free fight in case you wanted to watch one of the UFC’s most iconic fights in all of glorious five and a half minutes.
All in all, I was pleasantly surprised by the UFC’s first appearance in the 30 for 30 series. I thought the focus of this one would be a bit too tight, but the story was told very well, and most (if not all) major points were covered. Chuck & Tito dives deep into the rivalry between Liddell and Ortiz, and gives fans a good sense of why these two were so important to the UFC and how their rivalry began.
If coming out of retirement after eight years to battle fellow UFC Hall of Famer Tito Ortiz for a third time on Saturday wasn’t surprising enough of a decision for Chuck Liddell, the “Iceman” has something bigger to share about his comeback — this is only the beginning.
The 48-year-old Liddell (21-8), who was coaxed into retirement by UFC officials in 2010 following a trio of violent knockout losses told CBS Sports on Tuesday that his bitter rival Ortiz (19-12-1) is nothing more than a “tuneup” for bigger things.
“I wanted to get back into the game. I got interested and excited about fighting again and I needed a tuneup fight. And I needed a tuneup fight that we could sell,” Liddell said. “Tito is a great tuneup fight and a great measuring stick to where I am and where my comeback is. If everything goes to plan on Saturday, I’ll be ready to go and fight someone for real.”
“If I can’t perform to the level I expect to, I’ll hang it up for good.”
If you are choosing to remain skeptical about Liddell’s decision making, you aren’t alone. While Liddell-Ortiz III brings enough name value and remaining hostility between fighters to coax some nostalgic interest, it’s a fight that both UFC and even Bellator MMA — which has promoted the last four fights of the 43-year-old Ortiz — wanted nothing to do with.
Instead, the pair of legends and former UFC light heavyweight champions will meet on pay-per-view at The Forum in Inglewood, California (9 p.m. ET), under the banner of boxing promoter Oscar De La Hoya’s Golden Boy banner, which makes its debut in MMA.
Skeptics remain abound regarding how well the fight will actually sell considering the poor undercard and not-so-stellar public performances by De La Hoya in promotion of the fight. That’s not even taking into account the combined age of the two fighters (91) and the fact that Liddell has looked every bit his age during various workout videos that went public ahead of the fight.
Chuck Liddell vs. Tito Ortiz
Light heavyweight
Deron Winn vs. Tom Lawlor
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Kenneth Bergh vs. Jorge Gonzalez
Light heavyweight
Gleison Tibau vs. Efrain Escudero
Catchweight (160 pounds)
Walel Watson vs. Ricardo Palacios
Bantamweight
Jay Silva vs. Oscar Cota
Heavyweight
De La Hoya made both fighters equal partners with him in the PPV bout, which according to the former boxing star will net both the biggest paydays of their careers should the fight do well financially because of how large their percentage split is. That remains a big if, however, whether the fight will sell, especially considering ticket sales have reportedly been slow and De La Hoya lowered the PPV price to $39.99 on Monday.
Still, regardless of how many fans pony up to see it, the two legends will do business for a third time in a rivalry that once helped build the UFC into the powerhouse it is today thanks to the trash talking between them. Liddell won both of their meetings by knockout, including their 2006 rematch at UFC 66 that set a new PPV record at the time for the sport of 1.05 million buys.
“He says I’m a tuneup fight? Man, I think this guy has lost his mind over the last eight years,” Ortiz said. “You have to understand, I’ve been competing over the last eight years. The last time I fought was 2017 against Chael Sonnen and choked him out in two and a half minutes. My timing is there, my wrestling is there and everything is still there exactly where I’m going to need to be able to beat Chuck Liddell.
Liddell Vs Ortiz Full Fight
“At the end of the day, we are enemies, we are not acquaintances, we are not friends and on Saturday night I’m going to smash his face and we won’t be friends then either.”
Ortiz, who underwent a grueling 18-week camp to ensure he had properly recovered from neck surgery, said he would consider himself the winner of the rivalry should he score his first victory over Liddell on Saturday. He also thinks Liddell was “sandbagging” it a bit by making himself appear slower and older than he really is during public workouts in order to give Ortiz a false sense of security.
Tito Ortiz -285
Chuck Liddell +225
Light heavyweight
Liddell Ortiz Odds Against
“This is the best chance he has ever had against me but he never had a chance at all,” Liddell said. “Best chance? Maybe, but I don’t think it’s much of a chance. If I don’t trip and break my ankle on the way into the ring, I think he’s in trouble.
Liddell Vs Ortiz 2
“It’s the one thing that when I was retired I heard the most from fans, ‘Can you just come back and fight one more time and beat Tito up?’ That was the most commonly asked question from every third fan I would meet and they would say that.”
Liddell has heard the negative talk regarding his age and inactivity and isn’t buying into the notion that if Ortiz takes him down early, the fight is over.
“I will get back up and I will knock him out,” Liddell said. “It’s really simple. I’m very good at working out of the bottom. If he takes me down I will get back up and finish the fight.”
Ortiz, meanwhile, predicted he would end the fight via knockout.
Liddell Ortiz Odds Today
“What if I keep the fight on the feet and knock him out at his own game? I’m stubborn like that,” Ortiz said. “I just want to give the fans the best fight.”
Prediction
They say the last thing to go in an aging fighter is power and Liddell has twice proven already that he’s capable of changing a fight against Ortiz with one punch. But outside of that “puncher’s chance” in the first round, it’s hard to imagine Liddell’s timing or stamina will be anywhere close to how we remember him before a run of five losses in six fights beginning in 2007 ended his career.
Ortiz has fought nine times since Liddell retired (winning four of them) and has looked fairly credible during the twilight of his career amid his recent Bellator run. Should Liddell spend a large amount of the opening round on his back, it’s very likely his gas tank will be emptied.
The other problem for Liddell is his punch resistance, which effectively disappeared 11 years ago following his one-punch knockout loss to Quinton “Rampage” Jackson. Ortiz has remained fairly durable in recent years and has been stopped due to strikes just twice (via ground-and-pound against Rashad Evans and Antonio Rogerio Nogueira) in the 12 fights since he last shared the cage with Liddell.
Even if Ortiz eschews sound strategy and looks to trade with Liddell, it wouldn’t be a surprise to see him as the last man standing.
Pick: Ortiz via first-round TKO
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